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 Post subject: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: June 25th, 2008, 1:07 pm 
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The other day, my kids asked why I didn't want to watch Rosen Maiden even though I admitted I really like the art as well as the trailer for the show. This made me realize there are some shows that I seem to hate even though the show can be pretty cool and popular. Usually my bitter disgust boils due to subtle imagery or social implications. My big three are:

Rozen Maiden- The answer to every socially awkward boy is to own a precocious little girl?! :x The imagry includes blossoming roses? As in the blooming of maidenhood? :mad2: Way too close to child molestation avocation for me. :vomit: :vomit: :vomit:

Chobits, etc. (lovin' the robots shows)- Real flesh and blood women can't compare to the charms of programmable, artificial women who often appeal to the main characters by being submissive, super shy in personality, but super casual about their clothing coming off. Yeah... Just about the opposite of anything I would want my daughters to be. How pathetic. :evil: I get so annoyed at the social implications it ruins the innocent enjoyment of the show. Maid shows (especially Hanaukyo Maid Team) are not much better.

Disney's Beauty & The Beast- The classism rampant in Disney films (you have to be a princess to find true love, etc. :vomit: ) reaches it's pinnacle with the Be Our Guest number in which the servants sing gloriously about living to serve and never show the tiniest bit of resentment about being turned into inanimate freaks by a curse directed at their total brat of a master?! :vomit: Yeah, I know its a kids movie, but the last thing kids all over the world need to be self-indoctrinating themselves with are verses that make you happy with your place in life and celebrate being a servant. I want MY kids to be pissed off and to shoot for a better life. I'll whack 'em if they ever get complacent. That's when they turn into the Paris Hiltons of the world.



On the other hand, there are some shows I love for the imagery and secondary themes:

The Legend of Black Heaven (Kacho Ojii)- A god of heavy metal guitar get married, gives up his music and becomes a middle management drone. Then hot alien chicks make him play his guitar to save the universe. I gave up my art to get a paycheck. I desperately grasp at the hope that I can go back to making movies some day.

Fighting Spirit (Hajime no Ippo)- Wimpy kid discovers he likes boxing, becomes champion of Japan (and probably more, the manga's still going and I haven't caught up all of the way). I love how Ippo just loves what he does, I love how he never becomes arrogant or takes his opponent for granted, I love how he never gives up trying. It would be nice if my kids grew up to be that strong internally. It would be awesome if I could be as mentally and physically strong. I gots to get me more discipline.

Sanctuary (Manga)- Two Japanese kids survive the killing fields of Cambodia's Khmer Rouge purge, come back to Japan and decide Japanese people are fat, lazy and have no idea what it means to live. They decide the best way to save Japan is to take it over and drag it into the reality faced by the rest of the world. Beyond being a really cool story, it has awesome themes that could easily apply to any 1st world country: We don't know what suffering really is like. We don't know what survival really means. If we don't find out soon, those who have stayed hungry will eventually consume us and teach us suffering... We must learn to be hungry to keep moving forward. *sigh* So true. At least to me, that's why I like it.


So, those are my top three peeves and pleasures beyond just a cool anime or manga. What are yours?

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: June 25th, 2008, 6:01 pm 
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My 2 anime that both bug me and thrill me is:

1. Revolutionary Girl Utena - what bothers me is that NOTHING is really explained in the first 2 seasons (I haven't gotten apocolypse yet). The story is creative to me and I love it but the fact how nothing (like how Anthy became the rose bride? Why a rose bride is even needed? How the duels started?) is explained drives me crazy.

2. Fushigi Yuugi - The ONLY thing that bothered me about Fushigi Yuugi was the constant change and declarations of love. First Miaka loves tamahome..then hotohori..then tamahome. Tamahome loves Miaka then Yui then Miaka again. Nuriko "loves" Tamahome..then hotohori...you get the idea by now. Not that i'm not a fan of romance in Anime i just prefer when the main character loves only one person and maybe their love changes once or twice (but not 100 times).

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 3rd, 2008, 9:48 pm 
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PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
My 2 anime that both bug me and thrill me is:

1. Revolutionary Girl Utena - what bothers me is that NOTHING is really explained in the first 2 seasons (I haven't gotten apocolypse yet). The story is creative to me and I love it but the fact how nothing (like how Anthy became the rose bride? Why a rose bride is even needed? How the duels started?) is explained drives me crazy.

2. Fushigi Yuugi - The ONLY thing that bothered me about Fushigi Yuugi was the constant change and declarations of love. First Miaka loves tamahome..then hotohori..then tamahome. Tamahome loves Miaka then Yui then Miaka again. Nuriko "loves" Tamahome..then hotohori...you get the idea by now. Not that i'm not a fan of romance in Anime i just prefer when the main character loves only one person and maybe their love changes once or twice (but not 100 times).


Utena is too insane for me to even get bugged by it. As for FY, I confess I enjoyed it despite Miaka.

You know, I thought this topic would get more people involved. I feel so lonely. :cry:

Thanks for playing PrfsrSnapesAngel! :D

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 3rd, 2008, 9:52 pm 
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You know what i thought a lot of people would get involved too because with all the anime everyone has seen there has to be at least one that bugs you yet thrills you at the same time.

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 3rd, 2008, 11:40 pm 
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Well, I do have an anime that happened to be bugged by it, yet thrilled by it at the same time......

*Quickly closes off window behind this one*

The Ouran Host Club
*shut up*
Even though it's a shojo anime, but my anime club leader happened to liked it and he decided to show it. So I watched it and at first I was kinda iffy about it, with all the whole flowers everywhere, the yaoi-incest thing going on, and Honey-sempai (scares the Hell outta me), but the more I watched it, the more charmed I was by it's plot, characters and the humor. If you just brave those iffy factors that I mentioned, you'll enjoy it.

There I said it, now I must leave as quickly as possible before the angry mob comes after me with their torches, pitchforks and insults.

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 4th, 2008, 8:14 am 
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PunkDaddy wrote:
You know, I thought this topic would get more people involved. I feel so lonely. :cry:

The "What are you watching now?" thread is much more mainstream. We also have anime-specific topics. One way or another, we have already expressed our opinions.

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 4th, 2008, 4:35 pm 
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Mmsven wrote:
PunkDaddy wrote:
You know, I thought this topic would get more people involved. I feel so lonely. :cry:

The "What are you watching now?" thread is much more mainstream. We also have anime-specific topics. One way or another, we have already expressed our opinions.

True, but it doesn't mean we can't have discussions like this.

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 4th, 2008, 7:23 pm 
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Mmsven wrote:
PunkDaddy wrote:
You know, I thought this topic would get more people involved. I feel so lonely. :cry:

The "What are you watching now?" thread is much more mainstream. We also have anime-specific topics. One way or another, we have already expressed our opinions.

The "what are you watching now" thread is great for simply telling what you are up to and whether or not you like said series, but it really isn't a great place for discussions, which is kind of what this is in a way. Plus is allows you to talk about titles you saw and never posted about before.

I'll have to think about a title which bugs me and thrills me. I can't quite think of one off the top of my head, but I know they are out there. That's why I have an ANN list, for times like these!

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 6th, 2008, 2:04 pm 
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I thought of this thread while browsing through the "What are you watching" topic, but thought it was inappropriate there because I'm not currently watching any of these shows. I didn't intend this to be so much of a best/worst topic or current topic, but a pet peeves & secret joys type of topic. Mmsven, I apologize if you think this isn't distinct enough.

Of course, I could have phrased the Subject a little better since my intro was a bugs or thrills you selection... Now I have to answer Gojira's challenge and come up with one that does both to me - without ranting about the many shows that start out great and leave you hanging with a terrible ending. :D

Gunbuster: I am semi-allergic to giant robots, whiny characters and aggressively jiggly breasts. :roll: But the hard sci-fi, the drama and the animation was terrific. Gainax did such a fantastic job making the show appealing and fun, I loved it.

I can't really think of anything else right now. My mind is flooded with shows that I just plain liked or that had fatal flaws... ACmurphy- I look forward to your list. ;-)

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 6th, 2008, 6:20 pm 
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PunkDaddy wrote:
You know, I thought this topic would get more people involved. I feel so lonely.

I dunno why but I saw this thread just now and never before. :?:

PunkDaddy wrote:
the last thing kids all over the world need to be self-indoctrinating themselves with are verses that make you happy with your place in life and celebrate being a servant.

Uh, that depends on the cultural background. Especially in areas were Confucianism is widespread it is common sense to know your place and serve the higher goal of thus stabilizing society. And at least where I come from we have a middleway, embodied in the following idiom, or saying:
"Whoever wants to give orders should learn how to obey first."
("Wer befehlen will, muss erst gehorchen lernen.")
I believe that is true.

PunkDaddy wrote:
The Legend of Black Heaven (Kacho Ojii)

The show appeals to everyone's lost dreams, and most people have to give up dreams because reality wants it otherwise. There are only a lucky few.

PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
Revolutionary Girl Utena - what bothers me is that NOTHING is really explained in the first 2 seasons (...) (like how Anthy became the rose bride? Why a rose bride is even needed? How the duels started?)

But these are only superficialities. The meaning of Utena lies not within how it is presented but in what it is trying to convey with all the allegories and metaphors. We discussed Utena for hours and did not come to a conclusion that satisfied everyone, and that's why I love the show.

PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
Fushigi Yuugi - The ONLY thing that bothered me about Fushigi Yuugi was the constant change and declarations of love.

Fushigi Yuugi would be the show that thrilled me and deterred me at the same time. I love the action that is going on, the characters, the slapstick, the tragedies, and the mad brutality of several episodes. What I do not like is the melodrama, the love triangles, the disappointments, and the misunderstandings due to lack of communication.
But I was more thrilled than deterred, so I bought the two DVD boxes just after they were released and paid a horrible price - but whenever I take a look at this or that key scene I know that every Cent was well invested.


Shows that actually bored me to tears were "Zettai Shônen", "Honey and Clover", "Tactics", "Saint Seiya", "The Guyver", "Inuyasha", "Prince of Tennis", "Vandread" and "Venus Wars". I could add "Marmelade Boy" to the list, except it was not boring, just unnecessarily and menacingly lovey-dovey-complicated, with the only interesting point being the two pairs of parents living together in sweet hedonist harmony. 8)
There are more titles, though.

What really thrilled me was "Ghost in the Shell" (although the philosophy discussions and anecdotes are a little overwhelming at times), "Serial Experiments Lain" (also because of its "discussability"), "Cowboy Bebop" (for the very cool characters), "Full Metal Panic" for its overall humor and Sôsuke's personality, "Hare nochi Guu" for its whackyness (without being overburdened, like "Pani Poni Dash"), "Ima soko ni iru boku" for its shocking brutality, "Azumanga Daioh" for Asakawa Yuu's voice, and the list goes on and on and on.

I would be more elaborate, but I tend to write very very much, so I'd rather limit myself until someone urges me to be more precise.

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 6th, 2008, 7:31 pm 
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Might sound strange, but I was terribly bugged by something as "innocent" as Onegai Twins. The phantom of incest flew around the whole 13 episodes, and when the sexual tension was high, I sometimes lost my temper imagining
Spoiler
who the hell was Maiku's relative and who wasn't.


Incest is a really provocative theme for me... I've always found it so awkwardly disgusting, yet I can't ethically oppose against two adult people deciding to love each other (as far as no descendants are concerned).

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 7th, 2008, 1:52 pm 
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42317 wrote:
PunkDaddy wrote:
the last thing kids all over the world need to be self-indoctrinating themselves with are verses that make you happy with your place in life and celebrate being a servant.

Uh, that depends on the cultural background. Especially in areas were Confucianism is widespread it is common sense to know your place and serve the higher goal of thus stabilizing society. And at least where I come from we have a middleway, embodied in the following idiom, or saying:
"Whoever wants to give orders should learn how to obey first."
("Wer befehlen will, muss erst gehorchen lernen.")
I believe that is true.


:oops: I must sound like an ugly American throwing my culture around! Half of my response is probably cultural (the US is basically a country founded and populated by people who left home rather than accept status quo and were willing to kill to make change) and the other half is probably my punk aspirations. While I see the advantages of stability and the importance of wisdom, I also fear and feel the oppression of stagnation. Since I'm not particularly rich, nor powerful, I don't want to accept a role as a sheep and I want to change my place. Stability is my enemy. Hence, my overreaction and attitude.

Sorry if you see this as rude!

42317 wrote:
Shows that actually bored me to tears were "Zettai Shônen", "Honey and Clover", "Tactics", "Saint Seiya", "The Guyver", "Inuyasha", "Prince of Tennis", "Vandread" and "Venus Wars". I could add "Marmelade Boy" to the list, except it was not boring, just unnecessarily and menacingly lovey-dovey-complicated, with the only interesting point being the two pairs of parents living together in sweet hedonist harmony. 8)
There are more titles, though.


Boring someone to tears is a crime! While I disagree with “Vandread”, which I found fun and an interesting exploration of gender roles, I totally agree on “Guyver,” “Saint Seiya” and “Inuyasha.” I haven’t seen the others and I am only familiar with the manga for “Honey and Clover” (which I found very fun).

42317 wrote:
What really thrilled me was "Ghost in the Shell" (although the philosophy discussions and anecdotes are a little overwhelming at times), "Serial Experiments Lain" (also because of its "discussability"), "Cowboy Bebop" (for the very cool characters), "Full Metal Panic" for its overall humor and Sôsuke's personality, "Hare nochi Guu" for its whackyness (without being overburdened, like "Pani Poni Dash"), "Ima soko ni iru boku" for its shocking brutality, "Azumanga Daioh" for Asakawa Yuu's voice, and the list goes on and on and on.


Which was your favorite incarnation of “Ghost in the Shell?” I’ve only seen the two movies. The second one seemed a bit overwrought so I didn’t try “Stand Alone Complex” yet… “Serial Experiments Lain” was deliciously complex and thought-provoking! I’m not sure I really liked the ending, but, WOW, did it make me think. I need to watch the others (except the excellent “Cowboy Bebop”)…
As for elaboration, I always enjoy your writing. Don’t hold back for me. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Anime that just bugs you...and thrills you.
PostPosted: July 7th, 2008, 3:21 pm 
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PunkDaddy wrote:
I must sound like an ugly American throwing my culture around!

Conservatives are of the opinion that the US have no culture, because such a radical mix of cultural and ethnic groups is hard to imagine. Whenever I meet such people I offer the salad bowl metaphor, and most do understand.
As long as you keep throwing around cultural preferences - and not national pride - I'll still like you. :wink:

PunkDaddy wrote:
I disagree with “Vandread”, which I found fun

I watched half of it and while I liked the gender aspects I found the general story rather uninteresting. It was like the usual harem Anime without the character appeal of "Tenchi Muyô", "Photon" or "Amaenaideyo".

PunkDaddy wrote:
Which was your favorite incarnation of “Ghost in the Shell?”

In terms of overall story - the first movie.
In terms of character depiction - the Manga. I liked the concept of Motoko being a fun girl who enjoys having a drink with the mecha (Tachikoma?) which constantly complain about not getting enough oil. I was almost shocked when I came across a page that depicted her laughing! Kusanagi Motoko laughing! If you only know Oshii's works, can you even imagine her just smiling? I could not. Oshii's characters are so dead.
The second movie, "Innocence" was totally overburdened with deep-topic talk and philosophical terms. Completely unrealistic conversations - these people work for the police, they are not aged philosophy professors at some symposium.
"Stand-alone Complex" still has philosophy, but I didn't find it as disturbing. Almost refreshing, actually.

Last but not least, I simply love her name - Kusanagi, i.e. "grass cutter" (close to "lawn mower", eh), because the legendary ancient sword, given to Prince Yamato Takeru by the god Susanoo, thus one of the Japanese Imperial treasures (sword, mirror, orb), is named Kusanagi.

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