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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 7th, 2008, 8:47 am 
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42317, please don't misunderstand me, but I've been depicting your 12 yo self, with a biro at your collar, with a sort of lost gaze and mainly interested in RPG's, and I'm ROFLing absolutely. You remind me a bit of myself at that age.
I wish I had met someone like you when I was that age! When I was 12, I was merely some sort of girl who tried to stick with the changing fashions which blurted in the class from time to time, including the fact of kissing boys (we do that much sooner in Spain, the hold-hands starts when you're 10 or 11), but in the depth of my heart I was horribly sad, since nothing I did seemed to put me in better terms with the group of girls (I was slightly bullied as well when I was at school), plus I was feeling like not being myself. Meeting someone like you, who wasn't scared of being himself, would have been a relief.

It costed me two further years to admit to myself what I was, and I believe such a process would have been easier with someone like you around.

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 7th, 2008, 7:46 pm 
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No need for apologies 42317, your topic of discussion is far more interesting than my topic and it is somewhat of a tangent.

It is cool to hear that you are getting results from your little adventure! The image you painted of yourself is amusing as bloodfairy noted. haha.

I am impressed that you wrote her love letters back in school. I only replied to letters but I never made that brave first step of confession back in grade school. I can see how, years later, that she would be hesitant in replying to all your questions. Sometimes you have to wonder if it is really necessary to find out why something happened so far in the past, and why someone would be still interested much later. Both parties would have changed so much including the circumstances and environment.

42317 wrote:
In her reply she said that I was, like, the epitome of being uncool walking the earth, carrying my bag over both shoulders and a biro at my collar, walking like a soldier (without elaborating on that), and *gasp!* indulging in roleplaying games!
"That was it?" I asked, and it really made me laugh. But I must say two things about her arguments.
First, I only carried a pen at my collar because I had not always been as strong as I still am today, actually at age 12 I was pretty mediocre, and I was being bullied. After my pencil cases were frequently and violently thrown against the wall and all my pens were broken just as frequently, I decided to abandon the pencil case concept and stuck to a biro at my collar.
Second, I liked being uncool, in a way. I had a bunch of friends who accepted me, and they were all I needed. Most people didn't like me. F*ck them! That was the way back then.
I can agree with her on these grounds.
I hope you did not go on the defensive and explain yourself to her. haha.

42317 wrote:
It is on the other hand interesting to note how shy she was about the matter.
a teenage girl concerned about her image?! no way! say it is not so!!

42317 wrote:
Two or three minor questions are left, but I can be pretty happy with what I got I think.
You seem like an intelligent guy, I would think you could figure out the answers to these remaining questions. It seems like highschool kids all had the same similar problems... Unless your questions are very specific! ha!

42317 wrote:
But my tour of resolving my adolescent problems do not end here.
Funny enough, my first girlfriend appeared on the social network that I am a member of. We "dated" for half a year 19 years ago (autumn-winter season 89/90), which means we were 12yo. In spring, she said she wanted to break up. She didn't give me an explanation, which I'd like to hear now, because I only concluded, several years later, that she left me for my apparent and appalling lack of maturity.
I'm sad to admit that I wasn't able to stand by her. We would take walks together and even hold hands (hey, that's heaven for an uptight 12yo) - but only when noone from my peer group was around. Walking from class to the school bus I'd break off from her side when we approached the bus stop because I felt embarrased appearing to be so soft as to have a girlfriend. That was of course based on deeply childish "humor" that made fun of relations with the other gender, and my sense of masculinity was pretty warped when I was growing up.
yeah, i would guess you are right on your assumption on her reason for the break-up. girls mature faster... and you were 12 for christ sake!

I met up with my first girlfriend too (yes, another social network appearance!) about ~20 years later. We went for drinks, flirted with one another, and caught up on our lives. It was a lot of fun.


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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 7th, 2008, 7:48 pm 
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Well lets see..i am somewhat shy and i used to be extremely shy when i was younger. I was bullied in class to the point where i considered suicide and (obviously) didn't go through with it. I have trouble making friends and infact i pretty much have no friends in real life. The truth is where i live theres no one i even want to be friends with. I live in a small town where peoples idea of a fun time is doing drugs and drinking. I don't try to fit in but i am trying to find more girl friends or guy friends to hang out with. The girls where i live are *major* bitches all they care about is making people around them feel bad. Oh well thats just my little input :)

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 7th, 2008, 8:16 pm 
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having a shy personality would make things difficult. it would be easier for you to join groups with similar interest, then you could meet people with matching personalities. start making "activity friends" and go from there.

living in a small town would make things even more difficult since there is simply a less amount of people. i grew up in a small town so i imagine what you are experiencing is very similar. we really had nothing to do in that town that resembles some sort of "nightlife".


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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 7th, 2008, 9:37 pm 
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Yes it is hard but i live with it at the moment. Right now i would rather be alone then be friends with the girls that live where i live at. I talk to all sorts of girls at work that are actually nice i just never get the chance to hang out with them. As i said before most of their ideas as a fun time is going out drinking.

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 8th, 2008, 1:44 am 
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PrfsrSnapesAngel: The Internet is a godsend for people like us. ;) Only 20 years ago, it would have been impossible for us to find any similar-minded people in our area. Just remember that you're not alone; there's thousands of people like you out there. You just need to find them, in places like this forum.

I wouldn't say that I have many close friends in real life either, but that's alright. You can be alone without being lonely. Like you, I dislike going out, taking drugs or drinking as recreation. I'm much happier staying at home with a good book, a movie, or (more likely) my computer games. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 8th, 2008, 5:53 am 
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Bloodfairy wrote:
It costed me two further years to admit to myself what I was, and I believe such a process would have been easier with someone like you around.

I thank you very much, but in case the next candidate replies you will see that my attitude was a mere stubborn one and that I was actually rather weak-willed in the early days. All my life I rejected belonging to the large group of people who were considered "normal" (why do you think I studied Japanese?), and of course that caused a lot of friction. You see, faced with so much opposition, I paradoxically fell into "historically normal" German behavior and said "Jetzt erst recht!" I have no friggin' idea about how to translate that. "Now more than ever!" maybe, but for my ears it sounds too soft. It expresses a strong fatalism, in a situation where everyone is against you you'll try to deal as much damage as possible before you go down. Modern-time Germans have pretty much forgotten that, but I am sure it's still there. How else would one explain why it took a world coalition to defeat Germany - twice?

But something good came out of that attitude of mine. I decided to leave noone behind. Which is to say that I always at least tried to befriend the people who were rejected by the general community, and I still do that today. Social outcasts easily find a friend in me. Few people deserve to be left alone.

dbd_addict wrote:
I am impressed that you wrote her love letters back in school. I only replied to letters

Ha, you received such letters, you lucky bastard! :sigh:

dbd_addict wrote:
Sometimes you have to wonder if it is really necessary to find out why something happened so far in the past, and why someone would be still interested much later. Both parties would have changed so much including the circumstances and environment.

These are questions that have bothered me all my life. Almost half of my regular time is already over and when I die I'd like to ponder as few questions as possible. Except for a slow painful death I think there can hardly be anything worse than, in your last moments, regret things you've never done but could have done, especially when it comes to making up to people who were at least once important to you.

dbd_addict wrote:
I hope you did not go on the defensive and explain yourself to her.

I don't understand what exactly you mean, but I lay all my cards on the table. I want no false pride or shame stand in my way. I am not afraid anymore to unveil my mistakes and shortcomings (at least to people whom I trust).

42317 wrote:
Two or three minor questions are left...
dbd_addict wrote:
You seem like an intelligent guy, I would think you could figure out the answers to these remaining questions.

Not quite. Because despite her obviously being embarrassed with my behaviors she was one of the very few people outside my peer group who treated me like, well, like a normal classmate, and not some sort of... thing that they had to bear with. She talked to me in a friendly way, even initiated conversations, didn't mind sitting next to me on class trips... there's a reason why I fell for her. I cannot imagine why she treated me differently despite her attitude towards me. Conscience maybe?

PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
The truth is where i live theres no one i even want to be friends with. I live in a small town where peoples idea of a fun time is doing drugs and drinking.

Why don't you move? Sounds like a depressing place...

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 8th, 2008, 11:00 am 
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Zaxares wrote:
PrfsrSnapesAngel: The Internet is a godsend for people like us. ;) Only 20 years ago, it would have been impossible for us to find any similar-minded people in our area. Just remember that you're not alone; there's thousands of people like you out there. You just need to find them, in places like this forum.

I wouldn't say that I have many close friends in real life either, but that's alright. You can be alone without being lonely. Like you, I dislike going out, taking drugs or drinking as recreation. I'm much happier staying at home with a good book, a movie, or (more likely) my computer games. :lol:


Thanks! yes it does make me feel better knowing theres others like me out there.

42317 - i would be happy to move however it's not something i can afford to do right now. At the moment i am 20 living at home while i'm at college. I do have plans to get the hell out of here..once i can afford to leave. Your right though it is a depressing place..Streator has more bars on one street then it has shops. We are famous for our bars and our many gas stations.

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 8th, 2008, 2:04 pm 
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42317 wrote:
Ha, you received such letters, you lucky bastard! :sigh:
not really, lucky would be to receive a letter from a girl that i was fawning over instead... i was too much of a chicken to pursue girls back in gradeschool.

42317 wrote:
These are questions that have bothered me all my life. Almost half of my regular time is already over and when I die I'd like to ponder as few questions as possible. Except for a slow painful death I think there can hardly be anything worse than, in your last moments, regret things you've never done but could have done, especially when it comes to making up to people who were at least once important to you.
ah, i see what you mean. everyone of my breakups has been amicable so there were no feelings of regret.

42317 wrote:
I don't understand what exactly you mean, but I lay all my cards on the table. I want no false pride or shame stand in my way. I am not afraid anymore to unveil my mistakes and shortcomings (at least to people whom I trust).
the reasons for the rejection you listed were superficial, so i figure there is no reason to have to justify yourself. unless you think that carrying a pen on your shirt is a shortcoming... ;)

42317 wrote:
Not quite. Because despite her obviously being embarrassed with my behaviors she was one of the very few people outside my peer group who treated me like, well, like a normal classmate, and not some sort of... thing that they had to bear with. She talked to me in a friendly way, even initiated conversations, didn't mind sitting next to me on class trips... there's a reason why I fell for her. I cannot imagine why she treated me differently despite her attitude towards me. Conscience maybe?
hmm... it sounds strangely familiar to what you do.
"But something good came out of that attitude of mine. I decided to leave noone behind. Which is to say that I always at least tried to befriend the people who were rejected by the general community, and I still do that today. Social outcasts easily find a friend in me. Few people deserve to be left alone."
perhaps you can answer the reason by thinking about why you do that too? ;)

PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
Your right though it is a depressing place..Streator has more bars on one street then it has shops. We are famous for our bars and our many gas stations.
famous for many gas stations!? haha that is depressing...


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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 9th, 2008, 5:24 am 
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42317 - I'm glad you got a bit of closure from her, even after so many years. Your undertaking seems to be providing you with some results!

PrfsrSnapesAngel wrote:
Well lets see..i am somewhat shy and i used to be extremely shy when i was younger. I was bullied in class to the point where i considered suicide and (obviously) didn't go through with it. I have trouble making friends and infact i pretty much have no friends in real life. The truth is where i live there's no one i even want to be friends with. I live in a small town where peoples idea of a fun time is doing drugs and drinking. I don't try to fit in but i am trying to find more girl friends or guy friends to hang out with. The girls where i live are *major* bitches all they care about is making people around them feel bad. Oh well that's just my little input :)

That's so sad to hear! I think we can all agree that we are glad you didn't go through with it! As the others have said you should look at trying to move to a more friendly place once you have the ability. And the nice girls you work with idea's of fun=drinking :( I've never been one for the alcohol. If you can't have fun with people without throwing back a few you may want to examine just how much in common you have with these people! I'm with Zaxares, numerous times I just like to hang with myself, there is no one I like better! Always doing stuff with other people can be a pain, it's nice to just chill alone and do the things you really enjoy, like watch anime 8)

Though I must say, being known for having a lot of gas stations is pretty funny. (Must be because they are gateways for people to get drugs, etc.)

Well now for a bit of what has happened to me over the past few months, with a bit of history thrown in for good measure (and so you can actually see the full picture).

In 6th grade there was this girl that liked me. I'd known her since 5th grade, but I really didn't think about her much. Aside from having another girl I was kind of going out with (as much as a 5th grader "goes out") this girl had turned me into the teacher in 5th grade for selling paper guns! (Yes, I found a way to make these sweet paper guns and I had an assembly crew and they were selling like hot cakes! Till I got foiled by her). So she told me she liked me by way of telling me she liked someone in class one day, and after I named off every other guy in the class I was like... ME!?!?! lol Anywho, I wasn't terribly interested at the time, so I just let it ago, mainly because I had the other girl already. In 7th grade though, as luck would have it, I started to like her, a lot. But the time had sort of passed by us, and she had started going out with someone else and she told me she no longer felt that way about me anymore. Which didn't stop me from liking her, but over the next 4 year, 8th grade to 11th, I always held a special place for her in my heart. And though there were a couple other girls, it was never quite the same as how I felt about her. For whatever reason. We had stayed friends, mostly, through this whole period of time since 6th grade and we had a mutual friend (the one that got drunk the other night), so we saw each other fairly often, but it wasn't until the beginning of twelfth grade that we really started hanging out (usually always in a group setting) and we finally got around to, drum roll please, going out! Yes, we finally got to the point of talking about all the things that had happened between us over the years, she had broken up with a boyfriend some odd time ago, and so I thought it was a good time to give a relationship a shot. It didn't quite work out, and after 2 days she gave me the, "Aaron come over to my house tonight there is something I need to tell you." Which I knew what that meant (and I was, *fairly*, certain it wasn't that she was pregnant :lol:) so I was prepared for it going into her house, but she couldn't tell me why, or anything, at all. All she could say is that she was sorry and it wasn't my fault. So I left that night, somewhat brokenhearted (we did only date for 2 days, but I had cared for her deeply) and I drove home that night listening to Jimmey Eat World - Pain as I drove at about 90 (in a 45). So, as one would expect, relations between us were a little strained at that point, and after high school was over I only saw her twice over the next year, and not at all for the past two (and no communication either).

So I was very surprised when I got a letter from her in the mail, a little over a month ago. We used to send letter back and fourth, so getting a letter wasn't very odd, but after so long it was. Other than the basic "Hey, how you doing, thing is what's happening, hope everything is going well" half the letter was apologizing for what happened back then and her reasons why. Which mainly consisted of her previous break-up being very difficult and her not feeling like she was ready to get into another relationship so soon. And she felt awful about having to break up with me that she was unable to say anything else to me that night. It was a wonderful letter to receive, since I had always wondered what had really happened to have it end so quickly. It would have been nice if she could have said what happened a bit earlier... :shifty: but it was great to finally have a bit of closure that regardless of the near 4 years after the incident. So I have now been exchanging letters with her back and forth for the past month, and we are rekindling the friendship we once had together. Which is more important than anything else.

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 9th, 2008, 6:18 pm 
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dbd_addict wrote:
42317 wrote:
I cannot imagine why she treated me differently despite her attitude towards me.
it sounds strangely familiar to what you do:
" (...) I always at least tried to befriend the people who were rejected by the general community

:blink:

That is an interesting theory. I had never thought about it that way.


This just in:

I have had lively mail contact with my second love and first girlfriend, inquiring what her views about that time were. I gave my details a little while ago in this thread after I had just contacted her, to sum it up, I was immature and I felt childishly embarrassed having a relationship with a girl while at the same time being madly in love with her and sucking up every second of time that I spent with her - as long as my peers weren't watching. Apart from outer influences I had no idea about how to behave. I'm a reluctant person, pretty reserved actually, although I've gotten much more relaxed amongst people, and I had doubts, very strong doubts, whether my personal wishes were not a bit exaggerated for such an early stage. I really wanted to embrace her and could even imagine kissing her, but I was afraid I would shock her or something and lose her in the end. Those were my shortcomings, and one day in spring she told me that she wanted to break up. I was devastated, and as an irony of fate, as I walked from the place of rejection in that wet street, I found a 100 Mark bill on the sideway. (No shit!) You can imagine I had very mixed feelings that day.

Anyways, I contacted her, and she was very cordial, saying she was happy we had contact again after accidently bumping into each other 13 years ago, when I was preparing for graduation and she was becoming a, what's it called, a medical secretary, I think, you know, something like a physicist's handmaiden, helping him/her run the practice. We didn't talk more than a sentence that day.
So, after some introducing small talk I got to my point, explaining my feelings and saying I was sorry for hurting her. A day later she replied, and I was quite nervous about what I was gonna hear, and she says like:

"To tell the truth, I don't remember very well..."

:shock:

In fact, she had forgotten almost all about it.
You see, I remember a ridiculous amount of details, like I remember the color and pattern of the bathing suit she wore when we had our first date at the pool, I remember the movie we watched when I was at her house for the first time, I remember her warming my fingers when I had come by bike in the middle of winter, I remember her beating me at "International Karate", the clothes she wore, and of course the way she used to smile and laugh... and so on. And she just forgot everything beyond "I had been her boyfriend and after a while we broke up".
Such occasions create some emotional tension for me, because I remember things that I associate strong feelings with very clearly, I can virtually relive the whole scene like I had videotaped it (doesn't work with stuff that I'm indifferent to, like linguistics...), so when someone who was there and experienced the same moment tells me she did not remember I feel like I wasn't important, being ignorable, disposable.
Well, she said she had enjoyed the time with me and that I was in a sense special to her, but that she just couldn't remember the details, like why exactly she wanted to break up. I'm left with my own assumptions.

But she's less reserved than the other (later) girl, we are discussing a day to meet again for a little chat and rambling over old pictures.

As soon as I have them (old class pictures) I shall show you both of them.

Acmurphy wrote:
numerous times I just like to hang with myself, there is no one I like better!

That does sound a little self-centered or secluded you know. I can easily entertain myself without other people but there's nothing more enjoyable than hanging out with my old pals from school.

Acmurphy wrote:
being known for having a lot of gas stations is pretty funny. (Must be because they are gateways for people to get drugs, etc.)

Really? Over here it's more like the railway stations that are known places where drugs can be purchased.

Acmurphy wrote:
Well now for a bit of what has happened to me over the past few months, with a bit of history thrown in for good measure (and so you can actually see the full picture).

Oh yes! Drum rolls! Suspense! Out of the closet! :D

Acmurphy wrote:
this girl had turned me into the teacher in 5th grade for selling paper guns!

What is a paper gun?
Got a picture?

Acmurphy wrote:
Jimmey Eat World - Pain

Interesting song. You seem to have felt something like desperation. I'm more sensitive to depression. When may second girlfriend left me, it was "Time to say goodbye" (Sarah Brightman and Andrea Bocelli) all night. Although I don't understand a word of the Italian lyrics. The sound perfectly matched the way I felt.

Acmurphy wrote:
half the letter was apologizing for what happened back then and her reasons why.

Must be some sort of epidemic these days, making up for failed relationship attempts. :wink:

Acmurphy wrote:
we are rekindling the friendship we once had together. Which is more important than anything else.
:clap:

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 9th, 2008, 8:05 pm 
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Acmurphy wrote:
it was great to finally have a bit of closure that regardless of the near 4 years after the incident. So I have now been exchanging letters with her back and forth for the past month, and we are rekindling the friendship we once had together. Which is more important than anything else.
another success story! :)

42317 wrote:
That is an interesting theory. I had never thought about it that way.
i am a bit surprised that you did not notice that.

42317 wrote:
Such occasions create some emotional tension for me, because I remember things that I associate strong feelings with very clearly, I can virtually relive the whole scene like I had videotaped it (doesn't work with stuff that I'm indifferent to, like linguistics...), so when someone who was there and experienced the same moment tells me she did not remember I feel like I wasn't important, being ignorable, disposable.
i agree with you, though it is relative. her experiences are seen through a completely different point of view. i know that if i do not remember a person's name then they did not leave any sort of impression on me. though i also have a terrible memory... i do remember many different "moments" with certain people that i hope i will never forget. i remember the first moment that i crushed on the girl i am speaking about in this thread... i am sure she would not have a clue and/or remember that moment because it is simply not memorable to her.

42317 wrote:
When may second girlfriend left me, it was "Time to say goodbye" (Sarah Brightman and Andrea Bocelli) all night. Although I don't understand a word of the Italian lyrics. The sound perfectly matched the way I felt.
i love that song! and it too reminds me of someone. it also reminds me of a moment i had in vegas atop the fake eiffel tower overlooking the bellagio (the song was playing at the fountain).


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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 9th, 2008, 8:07 pm 
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42317 wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
numerous times I just like to hang with myself, there is no one I like better!

That does sound a little self-centered or secluded you know. I can easily entertain myself without other people but there's nothing more enjoyable than hanging out with my old pals from school.

I get really tired of hanging out with friends after a while. My roommate and I did so much stuff together over the first year I lived with him that I had to stop doing anything with him at all for some odd three months I was so sick of it. I agree it is more fun hanging out with people, as long as I am feeling it anyway.

42317 wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
being known for having a lot of gas stations is pretty funny. (Must be because they are gateways for people to get drugs, etc.)

Really? Over here it's more like the railway stations that are known places where drugs can be purchased.

It's probably because most places in the US don't have any sort of railway/subway systems. If you aren't in a big city, there isn't really anything like that for public transportation. (I've only been on a train twice in my life, and those were tours, not to go somewhere). So I guess Gas Stations take up the slack.

42317 wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
this girl had turned me into the teacher in 5th grade for selling paper guns!

What is a paper gun?
Got a picture?

lol, this was a decade ago! I don't a have a pic, but I can kind of describe it. I found a way to fold a couple pieces of paper so I could combined them together to be a handgun with a clip you could take in and out. At one point I even made an epic assault rifle with a scope that was adjustable and a mid length hand. Sadly by the time I made it I was no longer able to sell them. I sold the simple ones for a buck and I was going to sell the larger one for 5. I could even make them out of dollar bills, which was a specialty order. Those were good times... damn teachers and their problems with kids having paper guns!

42317 wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
Jimmey Eat World - Pain

Interesting song. You seem to have felt something like desperation. I'm more sensitive to depression. When may second girlfriend left me, it was "Time to say goodbye" (Sarah Brightman and Andrea Bocelli) all night. Although I don't understand a word of the Italian lyrics. The sound perfectly matched the way I felt.

It was quite convenient to have it on a CD in the car at the time. Otherwise I don't even know what I would have listened to. And speaking of Sarah Brightman, (nice song btw, it's actually one of hers that I have on my comp) I really like her Deliver Me too.

42317 wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
half the letter was apologizing for what happened back then and her reasons why.

Must be some sort of epidemic these days, making up for failed relationship attempts. :wink:

Must be! Another GF of mine contacted me about 6 months ago wanting to get together. That tale was much less interesting though. We still do talk every couple of weeks though.

dbd_addict wrote:
Acmurphy wrote:
it was great to finally have a bit of closure that regardless of the near 4 years after the incident. So I have now been exchanging letters with her back and forth for the past month, and we are rekindling the friendship we once had together. Which is more important than anything else.
another success story! :)

Success is sweet! 8)

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 10th, 2008, 8:38 am 
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Acmurphy wrote:
42317 wrote:
What is a paper gun? Got a picture?

lol, this was a decade ago! I don't a have a pic, but I can kind of describe it.

Can you make one and then shoot a picture? It sounds like a deviant form of Origami to me.
If you sold them for one lousy Dollar the production process can't have been too time consuming.

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 Post subject: Re: wit's end
PostPosted: August 10th, 2008, 2:17 pm 
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Well despite how crappy my town is..i do have one good friend! :)
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