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 Post subject: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 17th, 2007, 3:14 am 
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This is a response to 42317. Took my reply outta the anime section since it was somewhat off-topic.

42317 wrote:
Kesshi wrote:
I loved REC so much! So upset that there wasn't more of it.

It might be better this way. If something is really great, it's best to stop right there. Let's take Linkin Park... had they disbanded after the first album they would have been gods. Instead they made a second album that sounded pretty much like the first and then had to make another one which they propagated as completely new in style or something. (I might be lacking information there.)


Let's say that the second album was pretty much the same sound overall. What's really so wrong with repeating a good thing? As long as they enjoy the process of creation, yanno? Personally, I felt as though they refined their sound with Meteora, however subtley through clever lyrics, tighter and more complex beats, and the overall construction of the album itself.

Minutes to Midnight might not satisfy those fans looking for more of the same LP, with strings of rap intertwined with Chester's screaming vocals accompanied by rock rifts and hip hop beats. it's more introspective, quieter, softer, and people seem to have a problem with that. The band wanted to try something different. It's not an innovative sound, but it's a different style for them, and it doesn't sound half bad. You just won't hear Shinoda spitting on the track as often, or Chester screaming his heart out during every refrain.

Yo, I'm studying for 2 exams right now, so I'll come back to this again with a better... explanation for Minutes to Midnight.

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PostPosted: May 17th, 2007, 8:43 pm 
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I didn't like Minutes to Midnight at all, and reviewers didn't like it either.

I would have prefered they keep to their previous style.


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 Post subject: Re: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 18th, 2007, 8:52 am 
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Kesshi wrote:
Let's say that the second album was pretty much the same sound overall. What's really so wrong with repeating a good thing? As long as they enjoy the process of creation, yanno?

It cannot be an artist's intent to produce two things so similar, except if dedicated to some kind of comparison. For example change a concept like "Crawling" from fear to disgust. The result might be interesting.

Be it as it may, "Re-Animated" was quite the correct title for the second album. If you have to reanimate your work, I'd say creativity is pretty much dead. Giving in to the financial needs of some publishing company is a bad idea - of course, the artist often has no choice.

However, it is of course also important for the artist to enjoy the process of creation. If the item to be created is very similar to something (s)he has done before and can live with that - that's okay with me. Let him enjoy this strange kind of creativity - but I will hardly buy the album.
Changing the style pretty much completely like Metallica is as stupid as repeating the tone of an album, as it will estrange the fans. In different ways of course. I guess the average fan wants something new now and then, but nothing too radically new. The human mind is indeed strange. The hardcore fan will probably remain a fan, but eventually standstill means extinction.

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PostPosted: May 18th, 2007, 10:51 am 
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I was a fan of Linkin Park's first CD, and was a bit disappointed with their second, but still liked it overall. Seemed like a cop out to just rework their previous CD. Now, after a number of years they release crap like Minutes to Midnight and I am not pleased. One of the few bands whose CD I would have bought wont be getting my money now.

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 Post subject: Re: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 19th, 2007, 2:06 am 
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42317 wrote:
Kesshi wrote:
Let's say that the second album was pretty much the same sound overall. What's really so wrong with repeating a good thing? As long as they enjoy the process of creation, yanno?

It cannot be an artist's intent to produce two things so similar, except if dedicated to some kind of comparison. For example change a concept like "Crawling" from fear to disgust. The result might be interesting.

Be it as it may, "Re-Animated" was quite the correct title for the second album. If you have to reanimate your work, I'd say creativity is pretty much dead. Giving in to the financial needs of some publishing company is a bad idea - of course, the artist often has no choice.

However, it is of course also important for the artist to enjoy the process of creation. If the item to be created is very similar to something (s)he has done before and can live with that - that's okay with me. Let him enjoy this strange kind of creativity - but I will hardly buy the album.
Changing the style pretty much completely like Metallica is as stupid as repeating the tone of an album, as it will estrange the fans. In different ways of course. I guess the average fan wants something new now and then, but nothing too radically new. The human mind is indeed strange. The hardcore fan will probably remain a fan, but eventually standstill means extinction.


I never really considered REanimation a true second album by Linkin Park, as it was a remixed and remastered version of Hybrid Theory with a decidedly heavier hip hop slant. The album I was talking about was Meteora; a lot of LP detractors among my friends said that it was the same old drivvle. Hence, my little defense of the second album. Thought you were talking about Meteora, not REanimation.

And I might be in the minority for liking Minutes to Midnight, but I do. I'm not normally a fan of screaming rock bands, but I liked Linkin Park because of Shinoda and the sound.

<--- Huge hip-hop fan

But the third album is lacking in screaming, rapping, or unique beats. What does that leave? Whiney emo lyrics without the 'fresh' flavor old LP fans needed to pallet what the band had to offer? Heh, some people might look at it like that, angry that they don't have a pissed off white kid belt out shut up over and over and over and over again while some asian dood lays out a verse with angst and frustration dripping off them like so many crimson tears full of regret and QQing and the normal emo fare with a hip-hop flare. :P

Personally, I enjoyed Minutes to Midnight. I thought the sound of the third album is fine. It's more subdued, mellow in a way that some might think odd for Linkin Park, but is reflected in a few of their older, slower tracks from Hybrid and Meteora. I expected another refinement, and I got something surprisingly new and pleasant.

And hey, it's not about the fickle fans in the long run. You won't be able to please everyone, and even if you try to please your fanbase, you'll be accused of SOMETHING by some of them, be it repetition or being unimaginative. I'd hope it's music for the sake of music, and if some people find enjoyment in it, well heck, kudos. Screw the critics, screw the fans. Long live the music.

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 Post subject: Re: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 21st, 2007, 1:15 pm 
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Kesshi wrote:
Screw the critics, screw the fans. Long live the music.

Hmmm... breadless artists don't last long. :D
Go commercial success or go art. Both together is difficult in the long run.

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 Post subject: Re: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 22nd, 2007, 10:25 pm 
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42317 wrote:
Changing the style pretty much completely like Metallica is as stupid as repeating the tone of an album, as it will estrange the fans.

I hope I'm not taking this comment out of context (and I'd like you tell me if I am), but assuming I'm reading this right I've just got to ask: does the new Linkin Park album sound like Metallica to you? I suppose they could on Given Up and No More Sorrow, but I wouldn't compare them to something Metallica does, and it seems to me like there's a song like these on on every proper album Linkin Park's done.

Acmurphy wrote:
I was a fan of Linkin Park's first CD, and was a bit disappointed with their second, but still liked it overall. Seemed like a cop out to just rework their previous CD. Now, after a number of years they release crap like Minutes to Midnight and I am not pleased. One of the few bands whose CD I would have bought wont be getting my money now.

I'm with you on Hybrid Theory and (I assume you mean) Meteora, but I completely disagree with you on Minutes to Midnight. I consider this new one to be my personal favorite.


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 Post subject: Re: Linkin Park
PostPosted: May 23rd, 2007, 7:58 am 
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shgarland wrote:
does the new Linkin Park album sound like Metallica to you?

Hm... an interesting lesson in ambiguity. Thanks... because I am not of the opinion that LP sounds like Metallica. No way... I was just trying to make a comparison of some kind, since both bands have made changes in their styles, Metallica more obviously than LP.

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PostPosted: May 23rd, 2007, 5:01 pm 
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I thought I might have been misreading you. Thanks for clearing it up. I see what you mean too. A band changing it's style can be kind of like changing lead singers. On rare occasion it can work, but more often than not it doesn't.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May 24th, 2007, 7:04 am 
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shgarland wrote:
A band changing it's style can be kind of like changing lead singers. On rare occasion it can work, but more often than not it doesn't.

Oh, it worked with Sepultura. Great concert in 1999 (combo with Slayer and System of a Down) when they introduced Derrick Green.
Maybe LP should change members as well... for some new impetus. 8)

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PostPosted: May 24th, 2007, 4:46 pm 
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42317 wrote:
shgarland wrote:
A band changing it's style can be kind of like changing lead singers. On rare occasion it can work, but more often than not it doesn't.

Oh, it worked with Sepultura. Great concert in 1999 (combo with Slayer and System of a Down) when they introduced Derrick Green.
Maybe LP should change members as well... for some new impetus. 8)

I haven't listened to Sepultura with Derrick Green on vocals so I can't give you a fair reply to that. And I'm not saying it doesn't work; it did when Brian joined AC/DC and when Bruce joined Iron Maiden. Just that for other groups I like that it's happened to, not so much. I can go back to Iron Maiden for my point. The two albums they did with Blaze Bayley weren't a death sentence for Maiden, but they weren't what I'd come to expect from them as a band.


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PostPosted: May 25th, 2007, 10:44 am 
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shgarland wrote:
I'm not saying it doesn't work; it did when Brian joined AC/DC and when Bruce joined Iron Maiden.

I liked AC/DC better before the change, but Bruce was a real big plus for the style of Iron Maiden imho.

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PostPosted: May 25th, 2007, 5:58 pm 
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I agree about Bruce and Iron Maiden. Di'Anno was exactly what Maiden needed for those first two albums, but there was a shift in direction (even on Number, in my opinion) that just wouldn't have suited him.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May 27th, 2007, 7:57 pm 
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well when it comes to Linkin Park and their albums I have to disagree to some extent that some people said that the first two were the same old drivle, (I to am among the people who think of Meteora as their second instead of reanimated).

First of all the second and first albums had some similarities, but there was a difference between them, Hybrid Theory seemed much more flowing to me then Meteora and quite a bit more volume to it, Meteora on the other hand, although loud was a bit calmer then Hybrid Theory but seemed a lot more stitched together. the songs on Hybrid Theory just seemed to flow more easily together then the ones on Meteora. all in all Hybrid Theory seemed more of an atempt to feed of fans and get a fanbase while Meteora seemed more about experimenting with different setups.

Minutes to Midnight on the otherhand makes me think of balads more then anything else. there isnt as much energy in it as their previous albums. Haven't really listened that intently to it so I can't give a more indepth review on my thoughts on the quality and how it differes besides the fact that it seems to be a lot calmer.

all in all though it just seems to me that they're experimenting with their sound and what they can do, something that they have said they would be doing all along. If they really were just in it for the money they would have stuck to the same old Hybrid Theory style all the way through and not even thought about a remix album with the likes of someone like Jay-Z.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May 29th, 2007, 9:03 am 
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Dark One wrote:
I to am among the people who think of Meteora as their second instead of reanimated.

Well, if you define the world the way you like it, all will fit together. :D

Dark One wrote:
All in all Hybrid Theory seemed more of an atempt to feed of fans and get a fanbase while Meteora seemed more about experimenting with different setups.

That might be true, but such differences were a little too subtle for my tastes.

Personal Taste cannot be really discussed... it can go on and on and on.
Showing respect for other people's opinions makes it more pleasant but not less futile. 8)

But still, of course, speaking one's mind is important and that's what we're here for.

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